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For eight years, Australian actor David Berry has been deep in Outlander, playing Lord John Grey in the hit time-travelling Scottish drama. While fans were busy swooning over the heated love story between Claire (Caitriona Balfe) and Jamie (Sam Heughan), Berry’s Lord Grey was busy breaking boundaries, as a gay man in the 1700s. Now back in Sydney, Berry tells national TV editor Louise Rugendyke what it’s like to farewell the hit series and why his title of TV homewrecker stands.
Hello David! One of your earliest jobs on screen here was in Home and Away in 2012. What do you remember of it?
I did three months on Home and Away. I was the homewrecker [Logan Meyer]. I had the privilege of being the homewrecker to Samara Weaving and Luke Mitchell’s [onscreen] marriage. I just saw Luke [who now stars in Chicago Med] in New York when I premiered Outlander. It was like, “Hey, I haven’t seen you in 15 years”, but it’s cool to run into these people who got their start on Home and Away.
Did he remember you?
Yeah, I ruined his marriage, so he should remember me!
How did you do it?
I think it was, honestly, it was his fault, right? He [Mitchell’s character Romeo Smith] was neglectful of [Weaving’s] Indi, and I stepped in and was a shoulder to cry on.
From there you had a great run on the Seven drama A Place to Call Home for six seasons, where you played James Bligh, who struggled with his sexuality, and then Outlander called. How did you go from 1940s rural NSW to the Scottish Highlands?
I did the audition here. I was very privileged to have such a charmed run on A Place to Call Home. The network invested so much money into that show, and it gave me such a great experience, learning how to work on a set and in a very complex, well-written character. I think that really put me in good stead for the Lord John Grey audition that came up. I wasn’t initially very interested because I felt that I could tread very similar ground to the character that I’d already played [both Lord John Grey and James Bligh are gay], but I thought the writing was really interesting. And I went into the audition with not much ambition or hope, but was delighted to get it. It was pretty much a whirlwind after the audition. I think it was about a week after I got the role, I was there [in Scotland] with absolutely no idea what I was doing.
Had you watched the show?
I knew nothing. I kind of knew of it peripherally because a friend in A Place to Call Home had auditioned for the role of Claire Fraser, and I helped her read the sides [pages] for it.
So how was it explained to you? “There’s this nurse in 1940s Scotland, and she walks through this stone circle and ends up in the Highlands in the 1400s, with this hot dude in a kilt …”
When I got on the plane [to Scotland], I downloaded as many episodes as I could and tried to immerse myself in as much as I could. When I got there, they gave me something called the “Outlander Bible”, which I think Diana [Gabaldon, who wrote the books the series is adapted from] had written herself. It’s a tome, I’d say, which references all the characters, but I quickly just dispensed with that and went with my gut.
How would you describe Lord John Grey – he appears as a young boy in season one and then you appear in season three as Grey all grown up. What do you like about him?
It’s his enduring kindness and ability to love selflessly and without an expectation of anything in return. He loves courageously and loves fearlessly. Not just Jamie Fraser, but his adoptive son.
The difficult thing, though, is that he can’t have his one true love, Jamie.
One of the main points of feedback that I get from fans is a real yearning. Calling for Lord John to have some kind of meaningful romantic connection with someone, because, as we all know, he cannot have that with Jamie Fraser. And he’s had some very roundabout ways of being connected, tangentially through Jamie Fraser, with marrying his daughter, or nearly marrying his daughter, becoming his son’s adopted father, and then, of course, marrying Claire. What is exciting about season eight is that we may see another romantic interest for Lord John …
I mean, staring into Sam Heughan’s eyes must be pretty good …
Well, Sam is a beautiful man, and I don’t think I am at risk of being controversial on that topic! Millions of people agree with me, adoring fans of Jamie Fraser. I mean, he embodies that character so well. I often look at Sam, and the way that he plays that character, with just pure admiration. And, I guess, maybe jealousy in some sense, in that I don’t know how he just embodies this perfect human being. Both Sam and Caitronia have been so great for the show because they bring a depth to the characters, and they really embrace the writing and the relationship that they’re able to portray on screen is, obviously, one of the major recipes for the success of this show. It’s just so tangible and real, and that is a credit to them as actors.
Fans get quite obsessed over Claire and Jamie, and there’s constant chat about whether that chemistry has spilled into real life for Sam and Catriona. Is it weird being on a show where fans are so hardcore?
You’re right, people are very invested in it, to the point that I think there is this meta reality that builds around the show and the personal lives of actors – surely if two people portray such romantic interest on screen, then that must exist beyond the screen – which I understand. But of course, it’s not the case. We bring our lives, and we have brought our lives to our [character’s] blood, sweat, tears for the last 10 years.
It’s natural that fans have brought themselves to these roles. They’ve invested in [the characters] in ways that are often quite surprising to me, to the point where they believe these people are real. That’s a real privilege to have, to be actually in the hearts and minds of fans [so much] that you literally exist, that they think you’re real. That then makes me understand that this final season is actually something really emotional for them, as much as it is for us. They’re truly invested in this.
You also caused quite a bit of upset when Lord John Grey slept with Claire in season seven. The fans were not happy!
It definitely upset Jamie Fraser, and upset everyone on the show, honestly. And I was quite delighted about that. I guess it goes back to my roots on Home and Away, I liked being the homewrecker! But anytime you get a chance to really disrupt the material – and I knew I was coming between this relationship – everyone adores Jamie and Claire – so to step in between that and to just tread that line, was really quite fun as an artistic challenge. I know fans were kind of horrified, but I took a perverse delight in it, to be honest.
What skills have you left Outlander with? Horse riding? Swordplay?
Well, A Place to Call Home had already well acquainted me with a horse, so I could already put that on the actor’s resume. Swords, I was very well acquainted with them from when I was a kid. My parents always had a costume box, and it’s probably the genesis of being an actor. I learnt how to get better at jet lag, how to live in a hotel room for months and occupy my time, those practical things that exist outside the set, too. Outlander did give me an appreciation for Scotland – understanding the accent and how to eat haggis, and what Irn-Bru is [a fizzy orange Scottish soft drink] and Tunnock’s Tea Cakes, they always had those on set, all those cultural things they flash with pride about.
Lord John Grey has his own book series – a spin-off to the Outlander series – do you think we’ll ever see him on screen again? One of his first stories was called Lord John Grey and The Hell-Fire Club, which could really take you anywhere …
There’s a whole series of books, and fans have been very vocal about a spin-off series. There’s great material there that I’d be excited to explore further. There’s more stories to tell with the character, Hell-Fire Club would be one of them. I know there’s a lot of interest there. Diana’s written some amazing books and the source material is there, so yeah, I’m willing to do it. We’ll wait and see.
Did you keep anything from the set?
Lord John Grey’s signet ring. It’s played a very important part in the show since day one, and will continue to play a very important role through the final season as well. I don’t think I’m giving anything away with saying that. The ring was made for me when I first landed in Scotland; I had no idea what it was. It was explained to me by Terry Dresbach, who was the costume designer at the time, that it was to symbolise Hector, Lord John Grey’s first love interest. It’s got an “H” in it, and it’s got a lock of his hair in it, which the costume department also told me that they tried to fashion into the shape of Jamie Fraser. There’s layer upon layer there.
Oh yeah, I can see Jamie’s ponytail there …
I guess so. It’s kind of like a Rorschach test. If you can see Jamie Fraser, then I guess it tells you where your mind’s at. And I guess Lord John Grey’s mind is probably always on Jamie Fraser, to some extent.
Outlander (season eight) is now streaming on Binge, with episodes dropping on Saturdays, as well as streaming on Showcase on Saturdays at 4pm and 8.30pm.
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