On this "Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan" broadcast, moderated by Margaret Brennan:
- Sen. Mark Warner, Democrat of Virginia
- CBS News contributors Chris Krebs and David Becker
- New York Gov. Kathy Hochul, a Democrat
- Border czar Tom Homan
- Bank of America CEO Brian Moynihan
Click here to browse full transcripts from 2026 of "Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan."
MARGARET BRENNAN: I'm Margaret Brennan in Washington.
And this week on Face the Nation: Two American troops are dead and one missing after an Iranian missile hit. The U.S. military has launched retaliatory strikes. Eight consecutive nights of American bombing marks a return to U.S. combat in the Mideast. We will have the latest with Senate Intelligence Committee Vice Chair Mark Warner.
The exchange of fire comes amid a turbulent week at home, with the president facing questions on everything from immigration enforcement to tariff threats against Canada. Yet, in a fiery prime-time address last week, he chose to focus on election security and his 2020 loss.
(Begin VT)
DONALD TRUMP (President of the United States): I'm announcing the immediate declassification and release of critical intelligence revealing shocking vulnerabilities in our election infrastructure.
(End VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: A decision some members of his own party are now questioning.
(Begin VT)
SENATOR JOHN CORNYN (R-Texas): I don't understand talking about what happened six years ago in light of these upcoming elections.
(End VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We will examine the president's claims with CBS News election law contributor David Becker and former cybersecurity chief Chris Krebs, who was fired by Trump for asserting that the 2020 elections were secure.
Plus, New York Governor Kathy Hochul on her state's new data center moratorium, and White House border czar Tom Homan on growing scrutiny of ICE operations.
And, finally: Is inflation cooling? We will ask Bank of America CEO Brian Moynihan whether Americans can expect relief on affordability.
It is all just ahead on Face the Nation.
Good morning, and welcome back to Face the Nation.
America is back at war. There were new exchanges of fire this morning, with Iran launching missiles at U.S. partners in Jordan, with Israel warning that could spill into their territory and widen the conflict. Overnight, the U.S. targeted Iranian drone and missile sites after Iran's Revolutionary Guard killed two American service members and injured others. One service member is still missing from that attack. ' These are the first deaths of U.S. troops since the fighting resumed two weeks ago. To date, 16 American troops have died in this conflict with Iran.
For more now, we begin with the vice chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Democrat Mark Warner of Virginia.
Senator, good morning to you.
SENATOR MARK WARNER (D-Virginia): Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You are part of the very small group of people on Capitol Hill who are supposed to have sensitive information shared with them.
Since this was the second hit in about two days on a base where Americans are, in Jordan, do you have any insight into why they were able to penetrate those American defenses?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: First of all, condolences to the service members' families.
And it's remarkable in many ways that we've not had more casualties. We literally have hundreds of seriously wounded, but I think we're at 16 fatalities.
I would argue, Margaret, this is what happens when you start a war of choice. And as a member of the Gang of Eight, I can say unequivocally there was no imminent threat from Iran. You start a war of choice without a plan.
And, very briefly, if you go through what the administration finally said their goals were, regime change, well, the guys in charge now are worse than the prior crowd. Getting the enriched uranium…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: … no progress on that. It'll take 15,000 troops on the ground. Nobody wants to do that.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Fifteen thousand?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Fifteen thousand been the minimum assumption you'd need to go into these bunkers, take out this enriched uranium in canisters. Would be very difficult. The Iranians would be shooting at them. Nobody has been moving on that.
We said we were going to degrade their ability to use missiles and drones. Obviously, we've not been successful. On that point, it gets me particularly crazy, because we're using missiles that cost $2.5 million to shoot down Iranian drones that cost $50,000.
And the country that has figured out how to do this cheaply, efficiently is Ukraine. They can take out Iranian drones with $5,000 drones, and we turned down their offer of their technology. And then, finally, the Strait of Hormuz, you know, gas is now back up to four bucks.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: That's $1.20 more than it was, at least in Virginia, when the war started, and there is no plan on how we keep the strait open.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, the president said he might look at that drone deal. You're right. It hasn't been followed through on yet.
But just to put a fine point on it, back in May, the U.S. sanctioned Chinese entities for helping Iran's military secure weapons and satellite imagery. Does this direct hit signal to you they are getting targeting help from our adversaries?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I have not been briefed on whether they're getting targeting help.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I do know that these bases have been on and off under attack since the beginning…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: … five months ago of, again, this war of choice.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
I want to move to another topic, and that is, the director of national intelligence, Jay Clayton, who is currently the U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, seemed unaware under questioning this week that Tulsi Gabbard had been searching an election center down in Georgia, the state of Georgia, something that she does not have the legal mandate to do.
The president has also tasked Bill Pulte, the acting DNI, to dig up information on 2020. You pressed Jay Clayton on who won the 2020 election, and he said Joe Biden was certified as president. Is that sufficient for you? Do you intend to vote him out of committee? How quickly will this happen?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I have known Jay for a long time. I like Jay. I worked well with him when he was at the SEC.
But I was bitterly disappointed by his performance in front of my committee, not just from my questions, but from many of my colleagues, or him even kind of acting like he didn't understand what Gabbard had done in Fulton County.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: So, I will be voting against Jay Clayton.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So he won't advance out of committee?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: He will advance out.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: As long as all the Republicans vote for him, he will advance out.
And we're a little rock a hard place here. I hope – I know Jay Clayton will probably get confirmed. I hope we see the Jay Clayton that I know and have worked with. The one thing I also know is the absolute disaster we have right now with the acting DNI, Bill Pulte, who has no intelligence experience, who has nothing but loyalty to Trump, and, frankly, a past history, when he was head of the Fannie and Freddie, of taking private mortgage information and politically weaponizing that.
That is not the kind of person we want in as DNI.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So – so, you want a quick replacement, but you're not going to vote for his replacement, though you think – you think he's got the Republican votes to actually get the job soon?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I think, yes. I hope so.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You hope so.
The president, as you know, declassified intelligence this past week. He argues there's vulnerabilities in infrastructure. It has been public for years that the intelligence community assessed China tried to influence the U.S. election, basically change what people think, not necessarily hack their ballots, so to speak. Listen to what he said here, though.
(Begin VT)
DONALD TRUMP (President of the United States): This evidence shows that the election system we have dangerously exposes – and really exposes like levels never thought possible, to hacking, exploitation and foreign interference.
(End VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Has your committee been given evidence to back up those claims that suggest a direct ability to interfere?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: No, absolutely not.
And, matter of fact, here is the – there are so many absurdities and falsehoods in Trump's Thursday night speech, and I'm glad that most media treated it not as serious news. And I know some folks at your network – the journalists, I have huge respect for. I was disappointed that your senior management made the decision to cover it as news.
There's so many falsehoods. Where do you begin? You know, the only election that Trump is concerned about is 2020. That was the election that his administration was in charge of.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Matter of fact, the director of national intelligence, Mr. Ratcliffe, was DNI then. He's CIA director now.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: If there was mistakes made, why is he CIA director?
You know, he goes through this focus on China, when he forgets or just omits the biggest country that tries to influence on every election is Russia. We've documented that time and again.
And the complete conclusion of the intelligence community, 18 different agencies, said, yes, folks tried to influence, didn't mean they changed any vote, and they sure didn't interfere in the machinery.
Now, when he talks about getting all these voter files…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: … you can buy those. They're commercially available.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: What we should be more concerned about is the fact that China hacked into the OPM, which gives the background on all federal employees…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: … or when they hacked into some of our insurance companies and they got personal information on – on each of us.
But the idea that they and I would bet you a dozen other countries have bought up voter files or knows in politics you don't run in a state like mine – you know, I have to buy the voter file to figure out who to contact as my voters.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right, no, and some of my colleagues here have obtained them. You – went on Web sites and showed you can do that publicly.
I'm wondering, though, since the Trump administration has been in office for so long now, have they released to the Intelligence Committee their analysis of the 2024 election that President Trump won? What degree of foreign influence or interference was there?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: We have not had it released. The…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Why?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I have not the foggiest idea.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Because, literally, the 2020 election, which was so much hubbub about, it was – the president was briefed on January 7, 2025, so you know, literally – actually, that was after the – January 2021.
MARGARET BRENNAN: January 2021,
SENATOR MARK WARNER: There's no explanation.
And if Donald Trump is suddenly interested in election security, why is he taking the Cybersecurity Agency, which did on a voluntary basis – Chris Krebs did a great job on that years earlier as a Trump appointee.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: And they've basically completely downsized it.
Why have they taken the voluntary programs like ERIC, where, you know, if you move from one state to another, making sure that dead people don't vote or people who have – have – try to vote in two states. They've dismantled that.
The Election Assistance Commission, not very well known, but this is the group that works with individual registrars in states…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: … making sure their voting machines are safe. They – Trump recently fired the Democrats and made the Republican quit. Why is he doing all these things?
I believe it's because Donald Trump intends to interfere in this year's elections. He knows, if there is a free and fair election, his policies will be rejected at record levels.
MARGARET BRENNAN: What do you mean interfere? What do you mean interfere?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Whether that takes – I think that what we just saw was, this was the opening shot, the opening shot of trying to undermine Americans' confidence that their vote will be actually counted and mean something.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I fear as well that if he tries to pull something that could potentially – he's not ruled out bringing ICE to the polls. He's not even ruled out the idea of trying to bar certain voting machines.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, we're going to talk about what is U.S. law in terms of presence and how those election facilities are going to be run with our two experts next.
Senator Warner, thank you for your time.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Thank you.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We'll be right back.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: And for more on election security, we're joined now by CBS News contributors David Becker and Chris Krebs.
Good to have you both here, because I want to download from both of you what we should be understanding about this past week.
Chris, the president of the United States, Donald Trump, appointed you to run the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency – that's CISA that Senator Warner was just talking about – to help states protect their election infrastructure during 2020. That was a secure election, you said.The president fired you for saying that.
This past Thursday, he again insisted it was not secure. Did you read, did you hear anything that changes your assessment?
CHRIS KREBS: Not – not at all.
In fact, I would say that it further bolsters my confidence in the security of the 2020 election, between what has been released, disclosed last week, and all the information and the results of court challenges and other things in the intervening six years, six years.
But it's also, I think, a good opportunity to reflect on the good work that the millions of – hundreds of thousands, if not million or more, election workers that helped execute the 2020 election, the tens of thousands of federal government employees that worked to protect the 2020 election.
That was not something that came together a couple weeks before 2020. That was years in the making, and that work was solid.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Secretary Mullin said Friday he'll have a plan within 30 days. We are 100 days out from the midterms.
CHRIS KREBS: Yes.
And – and, in 2020 we had our CISA election security plan out in February of 2020. So…
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, just to – before we move on to the current day, just to put a fine point on this for you, Chris, so during his first few months in office, the president issued executive order against you, saying you promoted the censorship of election information, and he claimed you dismissed election malfeasance and serious vulnerabilities with voting machines.
In intel-speak, what you saw – interference would be hacking, changing, some of the language the president used in those on-camera remarks. What you saw, how would you describe the Chinese role in the 2020 election?
CHRIS KREBS: Well, I think there was an honest debate and discussion across the intelligence community about what China's intent were.
But, ultimately, when it came out in the intelligence community assessment that was released in the spring of 2021, it was that China had a preference, and that they were not in favor of President Trump, but their efforts were principally limited to influencing the American public, seeking to pay journalists, media. But it was an influence effort.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I wouldn't…
(CROSSTALK)
MARGARET BRENNAN: … journalists, if you're getting paid to tell a story. That's my own…
(CROSSTALK)
CHRIS KREBS: That – that's fair.
But it was – it was an influence operation, and they have been doing that stuff since the mid aughts, the mid 2 – early 2000s.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
CHRIS KREBS: This is not net new. They did turn up the heat, and they are still doing it today.
We have a significant and serious counterintelligence and counterespionage problem with China.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
CHRIS KREBS: And that's what I really want to see us talking about. What are they doing today? We have to put more emphasis on that.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK, here is exactly what President Trump said on Thursday about China.
(Begin VT)
DONALD TRUMP (President of the United States): They did not disclose to me as president or to anyone else. And, to the best of our knowledge, they did not inform Congress. In fact, all they kept saying is, this is the most secure election in the history of our country, a standard, very pat line that was divvied out to say.
(End VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Was the president informed of what China was doing? You were in those rooms.
CHRIS KREBS: In January of 2020, there was a National Intelligence Committee – community memorandum about the 2020 election that talked about the vulnerabilities we saw on systems and the work we needed to do there, but it also talked about the intent of adversaries.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
CHRIS KREBS: And there were countless memos after that.
So, you know, a lot of these products were in senior executive and policymakers' binders, their intelligence binders every single day. We used those to get out there and talk to the American people. I had an op-ed in September of 2020 to the general public that talked about various threat actors, including China.
So, I have a hard time believing that it didn't get up into the Oval.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. As China was described as attempting to influence, it was Iran and Russia primary actors directly undermining the election in some of those 2020 statements. It sounds like you're saying he didn't read the memo.
CHRIS KREBS: Look, we could not have been more clear, is my view.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
DAVID BECKER: Or search the Web.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Or search the Web.
DAVID BECKER: Right.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We did report on it on this network, I know, I remember.
David, I want to go to you, because the president said a lot of things. One of the other elements this week was what the Justice Department put forward. Harmeet Dhillon there sent a letter to states saying: "Any election official who knowingly retains noncitizens on voter registration lists or facilitates noncitizens in casting ballots will be held criminally liable."
And then DHS Secretary Mullin described here the consequence of refusing to participate in their program. Take a listen.
(Begin VT)
MARKWAYNE MULLIN (U.S. Homeland Security Secretary): If the election officials, once we gave them the information they need to secure their elections, and they chose not to, then those individuals can also be held accountable by fines, by penalties and even, depending on how far it goes, prison time.
(End VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: You speak to election officials. Are they concerned? That sounds like a threat.
DAVID BECKER: Hardly a week goes by where someone in this administration doesn't threaten election officials with arrests. This – this week, we had at least two prominent administration officials doing that. It's become almost a running joke.
They've been into this administration 18 months now. The total number of election officials who've been arrested for wrongdoing is zero, and that's appropriate, because not only have they committed no crime. They've actually acted heroically and patriotically to support and facilitate our democracy through a pandemic and after – in the aftermath with disinformation.
What Secretary Mullin is talking about there, he's trying to pressure states to surrender sensitive voter data to the federal government. And the DOJ has filed over 30 lawsuits about that, and they are 0-16 in those lawsuits so far. He's threatening them with arrest for following the law.
And so I think the election officials in the states feel very confident that they are following their state laws, they're following federal laws. They're doing everything they can to make sure this election is going to be safe, convenient, and secure.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We are 107 or so days out from November 3.
What Secretary Mullin talked about as well is, he said there's going to be a public plan in 30 days. Stay tuned. But he wants them to use the Systematic Alien Verification for Entitlements, the SAVE program, to screen for the citizenship of voters.
How does – how does that work? For people at home who may say, sure, there's a law that says noncitizens cannot vote in federal elections, they say, well, what's the problem with showing an I.D.?
DAVID BECKER: So, the SAVE system is a federal system that takes data from federal sources. It's currently in legal limbo because there are some challenges over whether it's legal or not.
And from the limited federal data that it has, it can then match it in some cases to data that states may choose to share with it. The problem is that DHS admits that data is incomplete. They don't have all of the data, so a lot of the individuals that they might flag are actually citizens. They just don't have the documentation in the federal database to back that up.
The states actually have far better data. The states are doing a really good job with this. And the reason they have better data is because, when you go into a motor vehicles agency and you get a license, particularly a REAL ID, you have to show proof of legal presence.
And that data, what you've shown, what you've documentarily shown to a government official, is kept in that database. And so you see election officials in states like Georgia, which is, you know, run by Republicans, and states like Michigan, which are run by Democrats, and all across the country able to do a better job of confirming that there are noncitizens on their voter lists than the federal government could ever do.
And they've been in office for 18 months, and now they're talking about coming up with a plan in 30 days.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
DAVID BECKER: And, in that 18 months, they've only charged 39 people throughout the entire country with voting as noncitizens.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Chris, we were checking for what election officials were saying after Thursday's revelations.
Republican officials in West Virginia and in Utah say they have no outreach from the White House about direct election threats. They said, you got them, bring them. Utah said they actually want the election security resources to be restored and to have the federal government stop filing "frivolous" – again, this is a quote – "lawsuits that consume our precious time and taxpayer resources."
There are what, 1,000 people who were cut from the agency you used to run. What should be happening to make sure that these officials have what they need? Because they said they do want some federal help.
CHRIS KREBS: Well, first off, exactly what Secretary (sic) Warner in West Virginia highlighted.
If there is intelligence that needs to be shared with the states, get it to them. And, typically, you share the intelligence with the affected parties prior to making a public announcement. So, if there was something net new in the Thursday night address that needed to get out to election officials, that should have gone out Wednesday or Thursday morning.
And, as of Friday, it had not, you know, trickled down to West Virginia. In 2020, we conducted 33 classified briefings with election officials, 2020, 33. As far as I can tell, there have been no classified briefings with election officials since the beginning of this administration.
So, number one, we need to start the partnership and engagement with election officials, get them the intelligence they need. We need to recapitalize CISA, rehire CISA, stand up the Election Security Initiative. We need FBI task forces. We need the DNI mission centers all around election security.
And we need to give them the funding and the resources they need to modernize their security systems…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
CHRIS KREBS: … and get the people there that conduct these safe, convenient, secure elections.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And, David, what are you hearing from the officials you speak with? It is the states that administer the elections, but what kind of federal help do they even want?
DAVID BECKER: Well, remember – and Chris alluded to this – in the first few months of this administration, they dismantled all of the work that the first Trump administration under the leadership of Chris had built and the Biden administration continued.
It took a long time to build trust and credibility and expertise, so that states would welcome federal assistance. That's not their normal status. And they built that up admirably. And then, starting in February of 2025, almost on day one, they dismantled all of it.
And so all of those things that – that Chris was talking about that are so essential to push back on foreign influence campaigns, they're gone. On the bright side – and this is a pretty limited bright side – the – that happened early in the administration.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
DAVID BECKER: So the states have been able to prepare for that. They have been trying – working and networking amongst themselves to fill that gap.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
DAVID BECKER: And at the end of the day, they have paper ballots.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
DAVID BECKER: They audit those paper ballots to make sure that they're counted properly. They've hardened their systems…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
DAVID BECKER: … their voter registration databases. It's going to be a secure election.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Thank you, gentlemen, both of you.
We'll be right back. Stay with us.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We will be right back with a lot more Face the Nation. Stay with us.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Welcome back to "FACE THE NATION."
We go now to the governor of New York, Kathy Hochul.
Good morning to you, Governor.
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL (D-NY): Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You've got a big day. World Cup finals in nearby New Jersey. I know you'll be attending those. So will be the president of the United States, the president of Mexico, the Canadian prime minister. Given the threat environment, are you competent in the security measures?
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: Absolutely. We've worked so closely with our federal, state, and local partners in law enforcement. We have been preparing for this for literally over a year. Over a thousand exercises, table-toping all the scenarios.
So, we're with the best, and particularly with NYPD, the world's greatest police force, I feel very confident in our security. And we're so happy to welcome the eyes of the world. The entire planet is going to be watching what is happening right here in the New York City area. So, it's exciting. A very exciting time for us.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Truly billions watching. And we will be, too.
Governor, I want to ask you about a decision that you made this past week that made very big headlines. You signed an executive order to ban large- scale data centers for a year. These are those big buildings that help to power artificial intelligence technology centers. It was just a few months ago you said data centers were a local decision for municipalities. What changed for you?
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: I would say what changed was talking to the localities and realizing they don't have the negotiating ability to – or have the clout to be able to demand that their communities benefit from this in a more dramatic way. They also don't have the ability to insist that these companies bring their own power or pay more for the grid. They don't have an ability to say no to tax breaks. And so, I decided that I could do much more, especially in this basically flooding the zone is what's happening now.
We have over 30 applicants. So, in a very short time, I changed my position to say, you know what, the state has to lead here. But it's not about being the first, it's about being the first to get it right. And we will get it right over the course of this year and help those localities negotiate the right way, make sure – keeping track of how much water is being consumed, doing a study of that during this year, but also insisting that these companies – and they're welcome with the conditions and rules that we set forth – that they also contribute to the larger grid because this is a huge tax on our grid and I want to make sure that the power is there, limited power, is there for the large companies that are creating jobs, like the Micron that we recruited here with 50,000 jobs.
So, we'll get the right balance. But I'll tell you this, people want protection. New Yorkers want protection. There's a lot of anxiety. Companies want certainty. We'll give them both.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, governors from red states, like Missouri, Montana, Wyoming, they signed this White House rate payer protection pledge, which I guess has A.I. data centers sign on to promising not to increase consumer prices like companies A.I. – OpenAI and Amazon say they'll help cover the cost of infrastructure upgrades. Have you talked to companies, these companies, about doing the same in New York? Why isn't a White House pledge like that sufficient?
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: Asking these companies to keep their word on how much they're going to consume, I'm more realistic than that (ph) perhaps. I'm willing to say, I will get it right in New York. We'll work with the companies. But also – and we're open to A.I. Absolutely. This is a place for – innovation is welcome and celebrated. But my view is, if you're going to succeed in New York because of our talent and our resources and our people, I want to make sure that New Yorkers succeed as well. So, it's not a one-way street. I don't want the companies coming in and telling us how to do things in our state.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: But there could be – they could be welcomed when I lay out the rules of the war – world – the road, which they will embrace. I mean once they know how to play the game, how to do things in New York, they'll want to come. But I need some breathing room so may agencies, I've got seven agencies dedicated to different elements of this, the economic development benefits for communities, how we manage how much they're going to be consuming in water.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: How we make sure that – I mean just to say, make sure the rate payers don't pay more. How do you enforce that? I'm more realistic. I want to get things done and make it really be effective.
MARGARET BRENNAN: It sounds like you want evidence to help get you to yes. But in the meantime, you are hearing concerns from unions, for example, that this is going to turn away jobs and that it will send a signal that New York is not a place for companies to invest long term. How do you address that?
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: That's not the right conclusion from what I've done. We've been very clear. And as someone who's created more union jobs in this state than anybody in history, the largest private sector development in American history is going on right now with this Micron. That is 20 years of union jobs building this. We also have tens of thousands of union jobs over years in building the Gateway Tunnel, which was stymied, stuck, not happening until I unstuck it.
So, I've got more jobs for union members. They don't have to worry about my commitment to their jobs. But wouldn't they be rather building jobs that there's jobs that remain after the construction season is over, that the project has built, that we actually have people, their neighbors, communities, people actually working in those buildings with long-term, good-paying jobs and not just focused on construction, which is very important.
So, I'm asking everybody to say, take a breath, this is not the end of the world. We'll get through this. And New York always leads in a smart way. And that's what I'm really proud of, of what we're doing here.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I want to ask you about election security. We're about 100 days out from election day. States administer the elections in this country, not the federal government. Are you getting the kind of election security resources your state has gotten in the last few years? Do you have what you need?
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: No, the federal government has basically been dismantling all the protections that we've come to rely on to protect this core essence of our democracy. The knowledge that when you cast that vote, that citizen's right, that obligation to determine who our leaders are, that it is uncompromised. It is not being challenged by the federal government just because they're so worried about the upcoming results. That is exactly what is happening. I want everyone to focus on it.
Yes, we passed the John Rights Voting Act. We have (ph) the toughest protections in the country. And just recently, I signed a law, many, many protections against what ICE is doing, to say, ICE agents cannot show up at polling places.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: Can you see this scenario? Black and brown communities across our country and in New York, where they're, all of a sudden on Election Day, to create that fear factor and intimidation factor that they're so good at. I do not want to see that compromise the validity of our elections. So, what Donald Trump is doing right now is throwing out the biggest red herring you'd ever see and questioning the actual results that are happening.
So, we're working hard on this here. I'll make sure that we are protected. But I can't count on the federal government on anything this phase (ph) because they're compromised.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Under federal law, armed agents are not supposed to be at election centers. The attorney general nominee, Todd Blanche, said he'd follow the law. But it sounds like you are still concerned that that might happen. Have you –
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: They don't follow the law very much at all, Margaret. They don't follow the law much at all. So, again, trust, but verify. I'm going to verify and ensure that New York state is doing it right. I don't trust that they're going to say this.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
GOVERNOR KATHY HOCHUL: Because what happens is, they say the day after, like, oh, well, we didn't mean to do it. Oh, sorry about that. You know, these are people that go around killing individuals in our streets. So, I - - they have no credibility with me when they say anything.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We will speak to the White House about that topic shortly.
Thank you very much, Governor.
We'll be right back.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We turn now to the economy. On Thursday, we spoke with Bank of America's CEO, Brian Moynihan, and asked him for an update.
(BEGIN VT)
BRIAN MOYNIHAN (Bank of America CEO): Well, affordability is a challenge – a talked about challenge that we see in our customer base. But as you look at what's really going on, we see a couple things. One is, the consumers at – our 70 million consumers, who spend about $400 billion plus a month, are spending about five or – six percent more money this month of June of '26 versus '25 and likewise in the first part of July here. So, they're spending money.
And, you know, while the consumer's reflect on higher gas prices are higher, food prices, and inflation and things like that, and are worried about it. What you see is, especially the middle third of households and the top third of households by income, their spending is growing faster. What's been interesting, frankly, in the more recent past, in the last couple months, we're seeing the wage growth of all income cohorts kind of coalesce together around three to four percent, which is good.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, they're holding in there, even though we're seeing gas prices have raised the costs by drivers by 31 percent since this war with Iran began. I know fuel inventories remain low. How are you thinking about how this geopolitical uncertainty factors in to planning?
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: So, the price of oil and gas affects not only the gas at the pump, which is what you're first reflecting on, and that is up. It actually started coming down and as the oil prices rise, it might rise back up. But it basically, when we were running around $100 a barrel of (INAUDIBLE) oil, you were running about a $4 and change gas price. It had actually come down form the month of May to June because that's when the oil started flowing more.
But I think if you talk to businesses, it's different. What consumers see is a concerning nature that is out there. But when businesses see it, they worry about the cost of goods that's coming through the pipeline. So, the goods that are being manufactured now have, you know, imported that oil and gas to go into the plastics production or the material production or the – whatever it was during the time when gas prices were higher. And that's why our team has inflation staying higher all the way into '27 and '28 and why the Federal Reserve will probably, you know, our belief is will raise rates, where six months ago they thought the Fed would be cutting rates. They're actually believing they'll raise rates to fight off this inflation and it will take them a while to get through it.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, raise rates. You think the Fed will act as soon as next week to do that? Or, excuse me, end of the month to do that?
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: I don't think we – no, more towards the end of the year our team has them raising rates. And, you know, I think based on the recent data that came out, they had three rate rises. Whether they hold that with some of the inflation numbers. But the reality is, it's sort of the tail end of this year into next year. And it really will depend a lot on the path of other price cohorts, other than just oil and gas at the pump. And that's the question of what's going on in housing and food and other places where you're seeing some progress – continued progress being made. It's drifting down and it's drifting down slower than people would like. But the reality this, this type of inflation takes a long time to squeeze out of the system. When you go back to the post-pandemic infusion of cash, and infusion of activity, that just takes a while to squeeze out.
MARGARET BRENNAN: When we looked at Bank of America's earnings recently, you had record sales in trading revenue in the quarter past. A lot of that, some of it churn, from, you know, energy price swings, but some of it, it seems, from the tech boom of these massive A.I. companies and the public listings. How do you think about that, what looks like a tech boom?
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: It's absolutely a strong market for technology and other IPOs. There's biotech, there's biology, there's drugs going out, getting IPO-ed and things like that. There's M&A activity.
And so, when you're talking about the investment banking activity of Bank of America was up 70 percent year over year, something like that, and our peers were up like amounts. And that has a lot to do – at 50 percent, actually. That has a lot to do with the amount of activity our corporate clients are doing. In part also, comparing to last year, which was a liberation (ph) day quarter.
The good news is that our company, the nominal dollars we earned in the first quarter and the second quarter went up in investment banking, and that's reflected in the environment around us.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes. Jamie Dimon said, "it's getting close to as good as it gets. We just don't know how long it's going to last."
I guess you're in that same camp. You don't – you don't know how long this is going to last.
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: That's always –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: That's – the pipeline – we measure what we call pipeline. So, I mean, what's the forward activity yet – not having yet booked. In other words, the deals in process.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: And activity is as strong as it's ever been.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, it's fascinating because Wall Street is benefitting from this IPO boom around A.I., but it is the state of New York, where you are sitting right now, that has now become the first state to bar the construction of large-scale data centers. There's just so much political heat around this, this idea of not in my backyard, and the president argues this is all a driving force for jobs and a good thing. Do you see more states following suit?
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: This is a classic struggle of land use. And everybody's working through it. And everybody will work it through differently. Whether it's the stories about New York putting a pause on – in terms of further development while they try to figure out the dynamics of electricity pricing, water pricing and things like that. There's other states who are saying, build – Louisiana has a major facility going in.
So, I think we see it hail (ph) differently. But it really comes down to America being America. My community, my town hall, my town meeting, my mayor, my council, deciding what they want to do, or my governor. And I think that's where the population is trying to figure it out. And so there's a pretty good tug of war going on, but I think, you know, the facts ought to get on a table. The decisions ought to follow what people want for their community. And then, frankly, the data center builders will go to the communities they want them.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So I know you've got a FIFA sign next to you and the FIFA World Cup finals are this weekend. The world's going to be watching. You're a sponsor. Given how high ticket prices are to these matches, have you been surprised at the turnout at the tournaments and the spending?
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: Absolutely not. What we've – we – our team did a research piece, Margaret, that said that the total amount that is economically generated on FIFA is about $40 billion. $20 billion will be in the U.S. And then when – even when we look in the host cities, like a Kansas City, we can see the growth rate in spending faster than other cities. So, it's having this on the ground economic impact. And that spending is going into what we call bricks and mortars. It's going into bars and restaurants and things like that, not necessarily only the people in the stadium.
And so it's an unbelievable phenomenon I think the United States hadn't seen for a while. It's seeing again. And to put it in context, you know, they're estimating two billion will watch that – the finals on Sunday, which is just an amazing amount.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
BRIAN MOYNIHAN: And that's what the brand strategy for us was, is – we had a great quarter internationally. We have a great international business. It's a very important part of what we do.
(END VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: You can watch our full interview on our YouTube channel or on facethenation.com.
We'll be right back.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: And we're back with President Trump's border czar, Tom Homan.
Welcome back to "FACE THE NATION."
TOM HOMAN (White House Border Czar): Thanks for having me.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Mr. Homan, we saw that two immigrants were shot in the span of a week. There was that one in Maine that was fatal just days after another one in Houston. We also saw that man fleeing agents in Florida, who then was struck and killed by a tractor-trailer.
I know you've been trying to keep the department out of the headlines ever since that streak in Minnesota that was deadly. How do you respond to those who say, what's happening now looks like very little has changed?
TOM HOMAN: Well, you know, first of all, we'll wait and see what the investigations – how they play out, right. Because, you know, I don't want to get ahead of an investigation on who's at fault, what exactly happened because we all know, when these investigations happen, there's going to be cell phone video, there may be city cameras, and, of course, then you got witness statements and affidavits from the officer and witnesses. So, we've got to let the investigations play out. So I don't really want to comment on the investigations themselves.
But, you know, I think, you know, Markwayne Mullin, you know, took some action in concern of the safety of the agents and how we do operations and that's why he did that, you know, that pause on enforcement on vehicle stops.
But, you know, I – my concern is – I've never – I've done this since 1984. My concern is I think a lot of the rhetoric that you see every day, especially in sanctuary cities and at these protests that resist. Members of Congress saying ICE isn't a real law enforcement agency. I think that – I actually think that emboldens some people to say, I'm not going to comply with ICE. And I think no matter what people think of ICE, right, no matter what you think of immigration law, you should always comply with law enforcement.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes. Yes. But in the shootings in both Houston and Maine, the people who were killed were not the intended targets. Have you caught the people you were actually looking for?
TOM HOMAN: One of them I believe we did. But, you know, that happens in law enforcement all the time. I mean we're working, you know, you get leads on individuals and you say, OK, well this subject lives at this house, he drives this car. And when that subject leaves the house, you know, 6:00 in the morning, and someone gets in that car from that house, you know, they assume, OK, this guys and they'll do a vehicle stop. And depending on when they make that stop and that person complies, either they're going to be arrested or released. That's the way it's supposed to be.
So, you know, law enforcement deals with mis identity every day across the country, not just ICE, every law enforcement agency. I was a cop. I know – I know that happens.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes. But these were fatal shootings, of course, in Houston and in Maine. And in Houston, it was an unmarked car. So, when you're saying, don't resist, these individuals who were chasing the man who died, they didn't have markings on that vehicle that would allow for him to know that they were ICE. It just looked like a car coming after them in the videos.
TOM HOMAN: No. They have emergency lights. Officers have insignia. So, when they get out of that car and approach the car, you can clearly see they're law enforcement officers. They can't – this is – these people –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, in the video that has been public, it's not a marked car.
TOM HOMAN: These people – I'm not saying it's a marked car, but they have emergency lights and sirens. So, when they pull someone over, they're going to activate their emergency lights. A lot of – a lot of police departments – I'm in New York City right now. A lot of NYPD officers are driving unmarked vehicles. And that helps them find people that don't want to be found, right?
So, you know, but bottom line is, we'll see when the investigation plays out, but they'd be alive today if they simply complied with a vehicle stopped by federal law enforcement. Just comply.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: You can – if you don't think you're being treated right and had no reason to stop you, then there's avenues to take them to court. Just sue. Get a lawyer and argue in court.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, the family of the man in Houston said they – he thought he was being robbed because it was an unmarked vehicle. Not that it was law enforcement at all.
TOM HOMAN: They had emergency lights. They activate emergency lights. Blue lights. You know – you know, in my vehicle I drive where I'm with my security detail we have emergency lights.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You've seen that on video because we haven't?
TOM HOMAN: Seen what on video, ma'am?
MARGARET BRENNAN: That there were lights. Because in the videos that we've seen, there aren't. And because there weren't body cameras, it is hard to substantiate some of what you are saying.
TOM HOMAN: OK. OK. Well, I have not seen the videos.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
TOM HOMAN: But I'm saying, our vehicles are equipped with emergency lights. Now, if they didn't activate the lights, again, I haven't seen that video. If they didn't activate the lights, then there's an issue there, right?
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
TOM HOMAN: But I'm saying, they are equipped with lights. So, let me just caveat that. They should have been equipped with lights and sirens. So, I do not know specifically if they activated those lights.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
TOM HOMAN: But as far as the cameras, Margaret, you know, everybody in ICE would have a camera now if the government wasn't shut down by Democratic members of Congress. There was money in that bill that they held up.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: I think it was $120 million to equip all ICE officers with cameras. But because the government shut down we're behind on that.
MARGARET BRENNAN: But they got $20 million in April.
TOM HOMAN: But the cameras have been purchased.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Uh-huh.
TOM HOMAN: But it wasn't enough. $20 million may have bought some cameras, but it doesn't buy the storage. It doesn't buy the resources we need for the thousands of FOIA requests we're going to get. There has to be storage capability to hold these videos for a long time.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Y Es.
TOM HOMAN: So, it didn't fund everything. But now we have the funding after reconciliation. The cameras have been purchased. Right now they're training the trainer and deploying the cameras nationwide.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Do you think it was a mistake for the Trump administration to have proposed the body cam expansion at the beginning of the term? Because I know you have advocated for body cameras and now you're playing catch-up, right?
TOM HOMAN: I think body – yes, I think body cameras are the way to go. I think body cameras let the American people know what that officer sees when he takes that action.
MARGARET BRENNAN: When will everyone get one?
TOM HOMAN: You know, you can have a cell phone camera from a witness on the side, you can have, you know, city cameras or whatever, but I want the American people to see what that officer sees when he makes – when he takes – when he makes the decision and takes action.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: I think the American people need to see what that officer sees and hears.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: I think it's important.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: And if you look at the data, body cameras actually exonerate agents more than they, you know, provide evidence of wrongdoing.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes. And it would certainly help with reporting and public knowledge.
Let me ask you about something else. The DHS secretary has said they went through public records and identified 250,000 non-citizens in four states, California, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, and Nevada. I know those states don't share their voter rolls, so it looks like they're just pulling this from public information. For those states, are you planning operations before November and you do acknowledge that it would be illegal to have federal agents at election locations?
TOM HOMAN: You know – you know that's a question of DHS. I'm not in the loop on that. I'm not familiar with the information that DHS just released.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
TOM HOMAN: I'm not in the loop on that. I'm the White House border czar. So, they'd be a question for Markwayne Mullin. I'm not in the loop on that.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. All right.
Mr. Homan, thank you for your time this morning. We'll leave it there.
TOM HOMAN: Good seeing you, Margaret.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We'll be back in a moment.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: That's it for us today. Thank you all for watching. Until next week. For "FACE THE NATION", I'm Margaret Brennan.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
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